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Laser Ablation-Inductively CoupledPlasma-Mass Spectroscopy (LA-ICP-MS) - Science topic

Laser Ablation-Inductively CoupledPlasma-Mass Spectroscopy (LA-ICP-MS) is an in Laser Ablation Inductively Coupled Plasma Mass Spectrometry the sample is directly analyzed by ablating with a pulsed laser beam. The created aerosols are transported into the core of inductively coupled argon plasma (ICP), which generates temperature of approximately 8000°C. The plasma in ICP-MS is used to generate ions that are then introduced to the mass analyzer. These ions are then separated and collected according to their mass to charge ratios. The constituents of an unknown sample can then be identified and measured. ICP-MS offers extremely high sensitivity to a wide range of elements.
Questions related to Laser Ablation-Inductively CoupledPlasma-Mass Spectroscopy (LA-ICP-MS)
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Hello!
I am interested in quantifying some trace elements in calcite through LA-ICP-MS. I am using iolite4 software. I collected the elements of interest to me, and I collected 44Ca to use it as an internal standard. Since 44Ca is not the most common isotope, should I use its percentage (2.09%) and multiply it by the total Ca presence in calcite (40%), or should I just use 40% for the value in the internal standard?
In MACS-3 standard, there is only one entry for each element, so in a tutorial that I saw, the value of 40% was used. I do not understand why.
Many thanks
Faisal
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And:
Jie Lin et al. Calibration and correction of LA-ICP-MS and LA-MC-ICP-MS analyses for element contents and isotopic ratios; Solid Earth Sciences,Volume 1, Issue 1, June 2016, Pages 5-27
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Between TIMS and LA-ICP-MS, ICP-MS may be most easier. But in case of range of technique i.e., K-Ar, U-Th-Pb, K-Sr, etc dating which is better for use in lab?
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Hi Md. Zakaria, this completely depends on your research purpose (and your budget). You need to know, at least, which mineral(s) you want to target and what decay system(s) you want to date. The answers to these two general questions would lead to completely different directions. For example, LA-ICP-MS is suitable for zircon U-Pb dating, but is not for zircon (U-Th)/He.
For U-Pb system, I would say LA-ICP-MS is the most efficient and cheapest instrument to use (e.g., for U-Pb detrital zircon), but it is less precise when compared to TIMS and SIMS. It would be even more complicated (e.g., sample preparation) for other decay systems such as Ar-Ar and K-Ar as the analysis would be more time consuming (~6-12 months per sample) and more expensive.
So there is no answer to your question "which is better", as different instruments and decay systems have their own advantages and limitations. Which one is better depends on what questions you want to resolve.
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Hello!
I performed LA-ICP-MS experiment using NIST 610. I also measured the concentration of different elements on NIST 612 for quality monitoring and control puroposes. I noticed that for all elements of interest, their calculated concentrations in the NIST 612 sample was very close to the accepted standard value, with the exception of Titanium which was way higher than the accepted one. What could be the reason of this?
Thanks
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So, according to my table of isotopes (Pure Appl Chem 1989 vol 63 no7 p991-1002), 48Ti is 73.8% of total TI composition, but there is also an isotope 48Ca which represents 0.187% of total Ca.
Could you be getting some 48Ca in your 48Ti measurement?
It probably won't cost you any extra time or money to measure 47Ti (7.3%) or 49Ti (5.5%), neither of which have isobaric interferences.
Perhaps 46Ti (8.0% of Ti) with 46Ca (only 0.004% of Ca) might be an option too.
I haven't used an LA-ICP-MS, so there may be some other things that other users might know about.
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At the end of 2021, we studied zinc sulfide grains from one of the Pai-Khoi deposits, Polar Urals, RF, using the LA-ICP-MS method. The content of more than 20 chemical elements in more than 70 grains of sphalerite with an admixture of wurtzite from different deposit zones was studied, and their distribution patterns were revealed. An unusual micro impurity of vanadium was found, associated with submicron ingrowths of the rare mineral sulvanite and many valuable patterns related to the distribution of Ga, Ge, In and some other metals. Using a new geothermometer and the fluid inclusion method, the formation temperature of this deposit was determined. A draft of the article was written, including new data. A plan for further research has been drawn up.
In 2022, with the help of colleagues from the Czech Republic, we managed to leave EBSD maps of grains with a maximum content of V, in which it was supposed to find colusite microinclusions. The resulting maps illustrate some grains' complex and irregular zoning according to sphalerite and wurtzite. Many articles are devoted to studying the distribution of micro impurities among these two ZnS modifications. It was decided to compare the available EBSD map with the trace element distribution map, which can be done using the ICP-MS method with laser sampling. But, unfortunately, our device was broken.
It has been under renovation for eight months now.
In this regard, I would like to ask the following. Can someone from the community lend time on your equipment and map LA-ICP-MS 2-3 grains of zinc sulfide (grain size ~400-500 microns)?
We are ready to add this person to the article's co-authors or mention it in the thanks section. I am prepared to come to your organization in person if necessary. Or send samples by mail.
I hope for your help. It is painful and hard on the soul because quite interesting samples on which many works have been carried out are gathering dust on the shelf, and new results have not yet reached colleagues.
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Not yet, our LA-ICP-MS started to work, but the quality of measurements is
unstable
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Q1: In many articles on jadeite and jadeitite(Shi 2008,CÁRDENAS-PÁRRAGA2021, Meng 2016, Abduriyim2017, et al.), scholars draw spider diagram based on trace element data and REE from LA-CIP-MS. But the number of elements in the horizontal coordinate is often different. What is the principle on which this is selected?
Q2: When some of the results of the test are below the detection limit(bdl) , or the corresponding elements are not detected (nd), how should they be reflected in the diagram?
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Trace element abundance plots (spidergrams) are used to illustrate the rare earth element or mantle incompatible trace element contents of a sample. The order of trace elements is usually shown in the order of decreasing ionic radii. In the case of the REE, where the lighter elements such as La have the larger ionic radii (due to the lanthanide contraction with higher atomic numbers), the LREE are shown on the left and the HREE on the right part of the spidergram. Elements concentrations below detection limit cannot be plotted. The computer program plotting the spidergram usually interpolates their values between its neighboring elements.
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My problem is that cassiterite measured on LA-ICP-MS is around 30Ma older than monazite from cassiterite parental granite. Monazites from one sample have wide age distribution (70Ma).
LA-ICP-MS methodology
Data processing and calculation of abundances, isotopic ratios and dates were carried out off-line through the software Iolite v. 2.5, using for the dating also the Iolite-integral VizualAge data reduction scheme by Petrus & Kamber (2012), and for the trace elements determination the Trace_Elements_IS data reduction scheme.
EMPA
calculated from Suzuki 2008
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What is needed to better assess this age difference is the temperature of crystallization of both minerals and their sensitivity to subsequent heating/chemical induced modifications at post-crystallization stage of the granite. Cassiterite is an oxyde mineral that is quite stable once crystallized, as for monazite, a phosphate, it can be more easily recrystallized via fluid or high temperature events affecting the granite. The spread of 70 Ma in monazites seems to reflect that one or more events induced partial Pb loss in the minerals. Cassiterite is more resistant and has possibly a more 'locked-in' age. You will need to verify the stability of both minerals to metamorphic and hydrothermal events that happened in and around the granite to support your interpretation of these age ranges. You need also to assess the crystalline capacity of each mineral to retain U and/or Pb in its structure, the more 'similar' in ion size and valence an element is to the other (eg. Sn vs Pb) the more likely the crystalline structure will retain the new element during a metamorphic event.
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I am the manager of a laser ablation lab at Cornell and we have an ESI NWR193HE that was installed Aug 2020. Its only been truly operational for about a year but we are experiencing a high loss of laser energy over time. Fluences of 5-10 J/cm2 are costing more and more of the laser's energy output. At about 6 months, we were already at half of the installation energy output, now at a year we're at a quarter. The service engineer has quoted us for some very expensive optic repairs but has anyone else experienced such a high loss this quickly before?
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Sometimes, backreflection or emission from a sample may damage the optics inside the laser resulting in a power drop. Use of an optical isolator is usually recommended to prevent backreflection into the laser.
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Dear colleagues, my team and I are currently working on developing isotopic dating methods in our lab focused on dating faults and set time constraints on the post-rift tectonic events of the Brazilian passive margin. We are already working with fault-filling calcite U-Pb data, but we also have several samples of epidote veins that we would like to investigate with LA-ICP-MS. I am aware of Peverelli et al. (2020) very interesting work about U-Pb dating of fault-related epidote using allanite as both primary and secondary standards, but we are open to other suggestions of matrix-matched reference materials if you have any. We are also looking for the Tara allanite standard for that matter, so if anyone knows a quicker way to acquire it would be of great help.
Thank you for your attention and best wishes to you all!
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Hello and good health, I am a doctor of petrology in Iran and I have worked on the faults of northwestern Iran and the volcanic regions of Iran and Turkey, especially Sahand volcano, and I have several articles. I will be happy to work with you and help you. I am waiting for your message. Thank you so much
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Hello everyone.
I want to use LA-ICP-MS to measure trace elements in quartz. However, I found the laser I used cannot ablate quartz. It seems that the laser beam just passes through this mineral (See the video 1). In some situation, after several-second laser ablation, the quartz bursts (See the video 2).
The laser I used is Resolution M50 (nanosecond, wavelength: 193nm).
So, does anyone have the experience for quartz analysis by LA-ICP-MS and can give some suggestions for me?
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Quartz ablation and analysis by LA-ICP-MS is possible with both nanosecond and femtosecod lasers. See the paper attached.
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I have ms ThermoXseries2, mostly working with sulfides and gold in it. For last two years signal for gold during ablation has become lower. No such problem with, for example, S or Fe or Ag. The same thing with solution. On tune U is lower than In. Li and Co is ok. Calibration on solution is ok, mass calibration and detector cross calibration also ok. Detector is new (2020).
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One possibility is that the heavy atoms peak signals (Au, U) have shifted in comparison with the lighter elements (Fe, S, Ag) over time. The machine may be reading on the side of the heavy element peaks instead of right onto the top of the peak itself. If you can access one, try a gold standard (or any other very heavy element) to see if your peaks are read at the right place in the spectrum by the software. Another possibility is that one piece of the equipment is getting contaminated with deposits (gold plating?) and interferes with the reading of the heavy element peaks .
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Looking for the cooperation from geoscientists having laboratory access/facilities to analyze Oxygen and Sulphur isotopes in delta notation and zircon chemistry by LA-ICP-MS.
The above experimental requirements are a part of exploratory work for probing fertlity status of a newly detected porphyry style mineralization in NE Indian Precambrian shield having all basic signature of mineralization.
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There are several labs in Canada to perform such analyses:
- Canadian Centre for Isotopic Microanalysis, U of Alberta
- Geobiology Isotope Lab, U of Toronto, Dept of Geology
- Isotope Science Lab, U of Calgary
also Carleton Univ. and U of Waterloo
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Hello everyone,
In the literature, it's very clear that when preparing otoliths for trace element analysis by LA-ICP-MS, people who section (cut) their otoliths subsequently polish them.
I am trying to determine if the polishing step is actually necessary, given logistical constraints in a current project that I'm participating in. Our current lab setup allows us to very accurately section otoliths and expose their core.
Cons of polishing are: (1) it's very time & labour intensive, (2) it potentially introduces surface contamination, either from the polishing surface or from other otoliths.
Pros of polishing are: (1) it evens out the otolith surface, which may be rough from the cutting process, (2) it increases the clarity of otolith microstructures (e.g. increments), (3) it makes sure the core is exposed (which we can already do using our cutting method).
What are your thoughts on this?
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Hello,
unless you sample is in the same matrix as the reference standard, then I wouldn’t count on laser ablation for quantitative data (in comparison to sample digestion). I agree with the fact that you should polish as fine as you can to avoid any difference in ablation rate
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Does anyone has experience dating scheelite from hydrothermal gold deposit using the following two isotopic systems (U-Pb by LA-ICP-MS and Sm-Nd by TIMS)? Any advice concerning the settings to use with the laser (using the NIST 612 glass standard as a primary standard) and the dissolution technics for the TIMS?
Thank you very much,
Pierre-Arthur
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Yes, my coauthors, Niki Wintzer (USGS) and Mark Schmitz (Boise State University) have dated hydrothermal scheelite using LA-ICPMS in U-Pb system as well as with ID-TIMS. Material is from Stibnite District, Idaho. We are writing a manuscript (in revisions) for Economic Geology. Also see abstract (Wintzer et al) from GSA meetings in 2016, 2017. However, as a quick word of caution, the LA analyses using glass standard proved to be not as accurate as results from TIMS (U-Pb). A correction factor was calculated to enable better precision from remaining samples with LA. Mark Schmitz developed the analytical chemistry and supervised the ID-TIMS work. Full details will be in forthcoming article. Also in recent dissertation (Washington State Univ.) by Wintzer.
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There are several destructive and nondestructive microanalytical analysis methods, but particularly I wonder about EPMA and LA-ICP-MS. The main theme of my research is dating, tracing elements in different geological environments, mapping them in melts, fluid inclusions, minerals and understanding environmental parameters such as temperature, oxygen fugacity, the water content of magma etc.
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Hi Huseyin,
It really comes down to what you are trying to do. I looked at both methods for my project on trace element geochemistry to characterise magmatic processes and fractionation trends. I ended up going with the LA-ICP-MS as the EPMA simply wouldn't be able to detect things like trace Nb-Ta in a rutile for example.
Both methods can do similar things, however, given that EPMA is a SEM based method, there are a number of additional analysis you can do that might be of interest.
It seems your interest is quite broad and so you might want to consider a combination of methods if that is an available option.
I've provided a brief summary below.
Hope this helps.
Zeb
EPMA:
- better accuracy
- better resolution
- versitile - can be combined with other detectors to provide a variety of data (back-scatter electron images, cathodoluminescence, SWIR)
-good quality control (QC) - lots of available standards and literature to support
- Can be time consuming
- Most EPMA's are typically 'tuned' to provide high quality results for certain parts of the periodic table. Can sometimes be limited by the number and type of monochromators used in the machine.
- more sample prep required (high quality polished surfaces)
- poor detection limits on trace element concentrations
LA-ICP-MS
- better detection limits for trace element concentrations
- faster
- less accurate
- QC issues - lack of reliable standards and converting CPS to ppm is somewhat of a dark art
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I will be collecting carbonatite samples for LA ICP MS. They will be ground in order to handpick zircon crystals for U Pb geochronology. I want to get 100 zircon grains. What sample weight should I take?
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Lots of different approaches, but at the end of the day, you can't go wrong with about 5 kg. Don't separate all of it, start with just 500 g. Don't do anything special, just crush and gold pan it, and if the sample is rich, the zircon will be there. A UV lamp can be used to see it in a dark room, or just go ahead and pick it under the stereomicroscope. If it is detrital, it won't get locked up in other grains. Baddeleyite is different, and the only good way is to extract using a Wilfley Table.
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If all known classical geotermobarometers does not work... :)
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Glad to have been of help. I don't personally do fluid inclusion studies, but I can suggest you a couple of persons in case.
Best, Samuele
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I'm trying to find the partition coefficient for REE in fluorite. There have been a few papers which say they have a Kd value but do not specifically state what it is in the paper. When I go through their references, I can't seem to find the value in those papers either.
I have fluorite from 2 districts and I have done LA-ICP-MS analysis on the fluorite. It is the the goal to try to deduce the REE concentration in the fluid based on the concentration in the fluorite. Does anyone have a good reference on the partition coefficient? I appreciate it.
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Hi Grace, please have a look at the paper by Veksler et al. (2005) in Geochim Cosmochim Acta 69: 2847-2860. You might find it very useful.
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I commonly find that detrital zircon samples analysed by LA-ICP-MS display discordia arrays, in Wetherill space, that plot toward the origin. This implies some form of recent lead loss - a topic most recently addressed by Pidgeon et al 2017 and Andersen et al 2019. In TW space, these analyses also imply recent lead loss. I typically observe these effects in older zircons, typically older than c. 1.5 Ga (arbitrary age). Could this be because older zircons are typically more vulnerable to lead loss? I do not think this is the case. Instead, I think it is simply because discordia arrays are exaggerated for older upper intercept ages and therefore more noticeable. A supporting question to my main question, then, is what does lead contamination during analysis look like in comparison to recent lead loss in Wetherill and TW space, assuming such contamination is allowed to pass through the data reduction process?
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I think it is safe to say that older zircons are more vulnerable to Pb loss. This is especially so for those with higher U concentrations (>400 ppm). This longer time combined with the more decay destruction of the lattice contributes to the opportunity for lead loss.
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I study contact and regional metamorphism of Dizi series, Great Caucasus, Georgia. I have a problem only with analytical part of my work. And It would be great to share knowledge and experience with someone who works in metamorphism.
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In obtaining your PhD you do not need help from outside except, perhaps, to suggest a problem. Once you have a possible problem at hand you must search the available literature to understand what has been done and the failings of past work that will define the scope of your project. But perhaps there is an obvious problem at hand, such as a nearby metamorphic terrain that has not previously been described or whose description is incomplete. You, of course, will need (1) a clear statement of your project's purpose and scope and (2) an assessment of the resources you will need, e.g. thin sections and a petrologic microscope. But, ulimately, the project is yours and, yes, it is nice to have a sounding board who can help you attain focus and avoid deteours down wrong paths. But you should take possession of the project as being yours and your contribution to the advancement of knowledge.
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I am a sedimentologist interested in sediment provenance. My department bought a LA-ICPMS and I want to use it for detrital zircon analysis.
However, since LA-ICPMS is a destructive method, I need lots of standard to measure zircon ages. I looked for commercial standards, and it seems that it is not easy to buy it. I can get some standards - for example, 91500 zircon - but it is not certainly enough.
Does anyone can give me an idea to get standards?
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Hi There,
It is in fact a bit of a fallacy that Laser Ablation techniques destroy more standard, whilst they are a more destructive analysis than SIMS and use more repeats, the standard chips themselves tend to be used much more efficiently. This is because laser systems can use separate standard blocks, with tightly spaced analysis, that can be repolished. SIMS wastes a vast amount of standard in general as chips are placed in each mount and only a tiny proportion is used. This means you can acquire standards for laser and make them last a very long time if you are careful.
Many zircon U-Pb standards are freely distributed, and the ones in larger supply can typically be obtained from those who characterised them. Check the original papers for the lab or contact. e.g.
Geoscience Australiav for TEMORA zircons
GEMOC for GJ1 (i believe Elena Belousova is the contact)
There are many more that are common in geochron labs that you can look up e.g. FC1, AS3, Plesovice, SL1, Piexe
Others are in abundant supply and can often be obtained online through eBay or gem dealers e.g. Mud Tank (Though there is always a chance of a duff one in terms of precision)
There a decent list of zircon standards and references in here
Kind regards,
Rich
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Does anyone could tell me which kind of features should I consider between the techniques Laser-Induced Breakdown Spectroscopy and Laser Ablation Inductively Coupled Plasma Mass Spectrometry to buy an instrument that will be used in geological samples for a geochemistry fingerprint focused research?
Both use Laser Ablation for particle generation so the sample preparation step is minimal but I would like to know about the instrument and maintance costs (if somebody has a shallow idea about it), the detection limits and the advantages that have one over the other.
I deeply appreciate your help in advance.
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Dear Cristhian
I agree with Prof. Baig and Dr. Marijn. LA-ICP-MS system as well as its maintainance is costly. It has been proved that LIBS works better even for the geological sample and is faster than the LA-ICP-MS. Finaly you have to decide keeping all the points in your mind in the present situation.
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We analyse U-Pb in zircons here and our data of 202 Hg is starting with 30000 cps and decrease 1000 per hour. We changed filters, gas, clean the station and heat the gold...nothing worked.
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Hi Daniel,
To follow-up on Martin's response, I should add that, depending on what type of ablation chamber you have, you should be able to "bake" the Hg out by removing the cell and sample holder(s) from the laser and heating them up in an oven at reasonably high temperatures (<75C). If you have a two-volume cell, do not forget to bake the inner cup as well. Be careful, though, since you might have O-rings, seals, and other bits and pieces that can be sensitive to heat. It helps if you a flush the cell with a constant flow of high purity inert gas while baking .
This should speed up the decontamination process, along with replacing all sample transport tubing.
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Dear all,
I would like to analyse the chemical composition of glasses that I study. One available method would be LA-ICP-MS (laser ablation inductive coupled plasma mass spectroscopy).
Unfortunately, the standard reference material I have available (NIST610) only contains P2O5 up to ~300 ppm and Al2O3 up to ~ 1 mol%. In order to properly calibrate the instrument for my measurement I would need one or several standard materials that contain at least ~10 mol% (~15 wt%) P2O5 and ~25 mol% (~35 wt%) Al2O3.
I didn't find suitable reference materials in the NIST catalogue. Does anyone by chance work a lot with phosphate glasses and knows a suitable reference material?
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Thank you for your quick replies. I didn't know the GeoReM database yet and it shall be very helpful with such research. Also the possibility of just using aluminium phosphate as a standard sounds good and straightforward. If I manage to compact such a powder material it might just work.
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I have learned that baddeleyite occurs in ultramafic and mafic rocks and is used as an alternative to zircon to date these rocks precisely (using U-Pb TIMS/SIMS/LA-ICP-MS/EPMA techniques). My questions are:
(1) What are the optical properties of baddeleyite (ZrO2) which can be used to identify it using a petrological microscope?
(2) How it can be distinguished from zircon and other similar minerals?
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Baddeleyite is also pleochroic and might have a greenish hue apart from the reddish-brownish colours mentioned by Leonid. Please find attached some microscopic images in transmitted (plane polarized and crossed polars) and reflected light. Field width is 180 microns if not stated otherwise. Of course a SEM/EDX investigation would provide more information. The rock containing the Zr phases is a potassic syenite.
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I have averaged my elemental intensities, I have my std values , created correction factor...
Thank you!
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Here is a recent paper that outlines a standard workflow and recommended treatment of LA-ICP-MS data.
All the best
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How can we calculate mass of nanocluster (Cu NCs soln, less then 2nm) if we don't have MALDI-TOF MS ? Can we use DLS or any other technique? Need expert suggestions.
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I don't think you saw my posting.  Yes, it should work if you have no material settling and in free Brownian motion.  However I've seen too many of these systems where the metal lies on the bottom of the container and ther's virtually none in suspension.
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Would be interested what is your experience/preference for epoxy resin for embeding mineral separates. Especially with the adhesion of very small grains (below 100 micron) in the resin during polishing. I have used 3 resins in the past:
Buehler Epoxicure - smells like a hell, rather soft, viscous when mixed, easily etched by acetone
Struers Epofix - hard, less viscous
Araldite 2020 - hard, least viscous of all
The reason Im asking is the recent experience with some very small zircon grains jumping off the Araldite resin during polishing and lasering. I do not think this was happening with Epofix resin before. Any of you have any experience? It would be greatly appreciated.
Jiri
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Just a bit of an update - new zircon mounts with variable grain size (from 40 up to 1000 micron) behave well in Epofix resin - almost no lost during polishing and I treat the samples quite rough :-)
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I am trying to avoid using NIST glasses because of matrix matching errors. I am hoping to analyze shales and limestones. I have a ton of ICP-MS solution standards and some money to purchase reference materials if needed. 
I am being vague because even if your method doesn't directly apply to my work, I'm sure it will be tangentially helpful.
Thank you!
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Please note that the nano-particle pressed-tablets are made from homogeneous powders, and pressed with no binder. The surface is smooth enough for SIMS analysis, and the tablets obviously also handle the vacuum of SIMS or EMP. I don't make these myself, but get them from Dieter Garbe-Schonberg. He has demonstrated their homogeneity, even when mixing crazy options of rock types as examples of the ability of this process.
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I've been looking for studies applying LA-MC-ICPMS for in situ 230Th–232Th–234U–238U analysis (ie, for 230Th excess measurement) on ferromanganese crusts, and have come up empty. Can anyone help? I want to be thorough. If you think they don't exist, that's also useful. Thanks in advance!
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Excuse me. I can not help it because I just search for stable isotopes of C and O
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Is it feasible to use the trace element data extracted from LA- ICP MS for the foreland basin sedimentary rocks; Sandstone?? I have already extracted the U-Pb ages but unknown about the uses of the element data available from the ICP MS ) e.g.;  Si29, Ti49, Y89,Zr90,Nb93,La139,Ce140,Pr141,Nd146,Sm147,Eu153,Gd157 and so on). If you have some papers regarding this type of study then please do suggest me
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You can use Belousova's diagrams for magmatic zircons to determine the nature of your detrital zircons.
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I did experiment on U-Pb age dating by LA-ICP-MS, and got MSWD -9, or even  more then 9, in two samples, can any one please tell me why MSWD  is too high, why it happens during this analysis.    
Regards Mastoi
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Apart from the possibilities that Hafiz gave, it could also be that there is more than one population of zircon (or whatever other mineral you may have dated); or that some of the zircons have lost Pb; or that you have underestimated the uncertainty of the individual analyses that you have used to calculate the age. Is this MSWD for concordancy, or for an upper- or lower-intercept age? Perhaps you should give the diagram on which you base your statement, and we can say something more.
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Hello
I'd like to measure laser ablation plasma using LP(Langmuir Probe).
Then, the LP's theory is based on Maxwell distribution.
However, some kind of laser ablation plasmas are not the distribution.
I have seen some papers about measurement of the parameters of the plasma using LP.
I'm wondering about the correctness of the results of these papers.
Please advise for this question.
(and please introduce any reference documents  if you know)
Thanks.
Yuki Nakamura
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I'm amazed that none of the other answers have pointed this out, but here goes. A Langmuir probe can indeed be used as a diagnostic for certain types of plasmas, but it cannot be used for a typical laser-produced plasma.
Langmuir probes must be immersed in a plasma long enough to make voltage measurements etc. Therefore the desired plasma must:
  • Be in "steady state", i.e. slowly changing over timescales of at least a second or so
  • Have a large spatial extent, typically of several centimetres
  • Have low mass and energy densities, so typically not much more than atmospheric pressures and temperatures below hundreds of electronvolts
Laser-produced plasmas typically meet none of the above conditions. Practical laser ablation happens with short pulses (nanoseconds or shorted), focused to spots millimetres in diameter. A plasma produced in this way is far too short-lived and rapidly expanding to get a measurement with a Langmuir probe. Even a CW industrial cutting laser produces turbulent, rapidly recombining plasma with steep temperature and density gradients. Making measurements on it with a Langmuir probe is out of the question.
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We would like to pick zircons from a fine-grained sedimentary rock which has much amount of pyrite. Without any chemical treatment, we want to get rid of pyrite. I checked their densities and magnetic susceptibilities, but they are not so different. What do you recommend me? Are there some heavy liquids or other physical process to seperate pyrite?   
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 Dear Zehra,
I understand that the separation of minerals is not the most important of your business.
The simplest method of separation - manual separation of minerals during irradiation with UV radiation. Zircon will luminesce green-yellow light color (see answers to Petra Vesela). Pyrite is not luminescent.
If you have a lot of minerals, I recommend using the automatic X-ray luminescent separators, which are used for diamond industry. In the diamond industry zircon is a poor mineral which is extracted together with diamond and clogs concentrate.
But if you do not afraid some change the characteristics of zircon, it is possible to heat a mixture of pyrite + zircon at 200 -300C for 10 - 15 minutes. After that, zircon becomes lighter, but they restore color later. The pyrite becomes magnetic. After the procedures ferropirite is removed by magnetic fild.
Vasily
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Is it possible to differentiate human bones of animal bones, by chemical analyses (elemental or isotopic) ? Is that possible by LA-ICP-MS or LA-MC-ICP-MS
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Dear Dr. Kenneth ..! 
Very interesting question,  At the beginning can't we use "comparative  anatomy" or external morphological characteristics for identify the differentiate in between  human bones of animal bones?if it is some thing like meagfauna?
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I would like to conduct compositional analyisis on a sample of medieval coins (alloy of silver with a majority of base metal content). It is known that the quantity of silver in these coins decreased over time; compositional analysis will help determine accurately the actual silver variations and thus, the relative chronology already proposed for these coins. I intend to conduct X-ray fluorescence analysis (full area scan). I would like to make sure that possible surface enrichment of coins (sometimes medieval coins had enriched silver surface) would not compromise the reliability of data. Could anybody give me some more information about XRF analysis (full area scan) ? Thank you very much
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Usually XRF analysis means bulk analysis, meaning the sample is considered homogeneous in depth. Elemental depth gradients cannot be resolved with standard XRF geometry, thus, when measuring a sample with surface enrichment or depletion, quantification values are not strictly correct, as you are using a 'incorrect' modell of your sample. Just to give you an idea, in metals the information depth of fluorescence lines is on the order of a few 10s of µm. I guess a cross section would give you the easiest access to the stratigraphy. If non-destructiveness is mandatory, maybe techniques such as grazing incidence XRF might be usefull.
I am also confident, that there have been a couple of studies dealing with ancient coins, if not even book chapters.
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I have done  La-ICP-MS on the zircon and ICP-MC analyses on the whole rock. Can I use Ce concentration in the whole rock Instead of concentration of the element in the melt? 
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Dear LU,
Please find the attached file. When you use this Excel table, copy your own zircon trace elements data and the corresponding whole rock trace elements data to the yellow part of the table, and don't change the other coefficients, and then you can obtain the zircon Ce(IV)/Ce(III) values in the summary part of the table (the line with green color). 
best wishes,
KK
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I had ICP-OES process on Cd accumulation (In %65 Merck HNO3). But my results are in mg/kg. I guess 1 mg/kg = 1 ppm, so I can use same value with ppm unit. Am I thinking right or there is a tricky point that I miss?
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I agree, "1 ppm" is just a way of saying "one [part] in a million". That can be µg/g, g/t, µ-mol/mol, or even differences in isotopic ratios. Ppm in itself is a dimensionless ratio.
I'd say that if you want to say you have a one-in-a-million chance to win the lottery, then "picks of the right numbers occur at ppm-level" is a correct statement (although in reality the chances are well below ppt-level).
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I have a 208 V ICP-OES from US but the power supply in my country is 220V. I need to use the equipment for my trace metal analysis while working on incineration waste and I do not have the user's guide. 
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You can check the manual online. Concerning the voltage, check if you can get power regulator.
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Hello, Everyone. As the title of this question, I hope someone would provide more detailed indicators to help me make a decision when I process my raw data. Thanks a lot!  
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In addition to Leonid's suggestion, if the 206/204 ratio cannot be measured precisely and accurately (either because of the isobaric Hg interference, and/or if the 204 counts are too low), then you could plot the data on a concordia diagram, and assess if the zircons are discordant.
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Please explain the difference between the spot size and the crater diameter and how to find them? the ablation threshold range of steels machined by femtosecond laser?
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Most popular method being D-square method (https://www.osapublishing.org/ol/abstract.cfm?URI=ol-7-5-196). You plot the square of the crater diameter against laser power/pulse fluence/fluence(if you know w0). This method allows you deduce ablation threshold, w0 and incubation coefficient of any given material.
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'Im working on ICP MS perkin elmer Elan 9000 series. I am getting very high intensities. For the past two days I m facing the problem. Not able to rectify the problem can anyone suggest a solution
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In my humble opinion, I think that possibly should do the cleaning only with nitric acid, and not add any mixture of solvents, or first one and then the other acid, because maybe that is generating this problem and should also be careful to keep on for a while after cleaning to remove any residues at least an hour and a half. and then test a series of standards with known concentrations to ensure that cleanup was effective.
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  • 'Im working on ICP MS perkin elmer Elan 9000 series. I am getting very high intensities. For the past two days I m facing the problem. Not able to rectify the problem can anyone suggest a solution
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I agree with Leonid that concordant data are inconsistent with Pb loss. Otherwise, similar morphology is a very vague indicator, and a more thorough study of the zircons (CL, composition) should get us closer to the answer. Dating does not make much sense without a good knowledge/documentation of the analyzed crystals. And yes, the youngest concordant ages are likely to represent crystallization ages, while the older ones are most probably inherited.
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I have been through the manual of UranOS software but very limited information is provided over there. I am able process the data and getting some dates also, but the error is quite high (+/-200 Ma). I don't know where I am doing mistakes, but I have followed all what's there in manual. Is there any detailed manual available or had somebody worked with this software? Please help.
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Thank you! By the way, what is the equipment (and method) that you are employing to analyze your samples? 
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Dear Researcher,
I want to generate data of zircons by LA-ICP-MS. I have about ten plutons from a Precambrian sield of NE Indiia, having Supercontinental partnership with Columbia and Pan-African assemblies,  whose data are needed in a metallogenc appraisal. There is practically no data on geochronology and crustal history of development. May I have the academic partnership to grow through joint publications? I seek answer from like minded workers who can provide me the facility. This will be trusted one with great honour.
Can Any researcher help me?
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I am potentially interested in collaborating. Info about our lab is here: https://sites.google.com/site/icpgeolucsb/
You can email me for more information: cottle@geol.ucsb.edu
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i have taken spectra of different elements and i have used the equations (wiley 1995). but experimental time does not match with this calculation. how can i fix this problem
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In ToF mass spectrometry the relation between mass (m) and time-of-flight (t) is determined by the kinetic energy that is the same for all ions
Ekin = 1/2 m* v^2 (with v=s/t) 
as also the flight path s is the same this ultimately leads to : m ~  t^2.
In practice, however, your starting time is not 0, but there is a small shift t0 (can be positive or negative): m=(t-t0)^2 * k
To work out both constants k and t0 you just need two known masses and their time of flight. If this calibration does not give reasonable masses for other substances you should check what you use for calibration, metals could oxidize and you may not see the elemental ion, but oxides...
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I want some characterization ways for showing that an ion is doped into a lattice. Except FTIR and XPS.
And how can find that how much is doped into lattice?
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Dear Motahare Mohseni,
I can also suggest Photoluminescence (PL) measurements with high resolution. PL is a very sensitive, fast and non-destructive technique and it is commonly available.
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Is the LA-ICP/MS technique suitable for the quantitative or semiquantitative determination of elements and their isotopes or is it only useful to obtain element and isotopes ratios ?
One of the limitations is the lack of good standard references (glasses) for most of the environmental and geological samples
Samples of interest are: volcanic tephra, sediments, soils, dust, aerosols, potable water, waste water, and so.
Does somebody have experience with it?
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Hallo Maria
LA (Laser Ablation) and ICP-MS (Inductively coupled plasma mass spectrometry) are two different things. Potentially you could couple a laser to a variety of analytical instruments as MS, SF-MS, ToF, AES etc.
With LA-ICP-MS you can obtain both element concentration and isotope data including the Rb-Sr1 system or U-Pb dating2. I recommend you have a look here: http://pubs.rsc.org/en/journals/journalissues/ja#!recentarticles&adv
If you are interested in LA-ICP-MS of isotopes maybe the search term triple quad or ICPQQQ could be interesting for you.
The samples you named are very different, although LA has been done on liquids (mostly to generate nanoparticles), this wouldn't be the method of choice for water analysis.
(1): Jochum, K. P. et al., 2009 In situ Sr isotopic analysis of low Sr silicates using LA-ICP-MS, J. Anal. At. Spectrum., Volume 24, Issue 9, Pages 1237-1243, http://dx.doi.org/10.1039/B905045K
(2): Simon, E. J. et al., 2004 The application of laser ablation-inductively coupled plasma-mass spectrometry to in situ U–Pb zircon geochronology, Chemical Geology, Volume 211, Issues 1–2, Pages 47-69, http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.chemgeo.2004.06.017.
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Does anyone use hydrogen during the laser ablation in hellium atmosphere for increasing sensivity and what rough ratio of hellium to hydrogen flow is more suitable?
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Hi Yuri. I am not using hydrogen (too light) but rather Nitrogen (3 to 4 ml/mn). It works very well to increase the signal for heavy isotopes.
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I am going to be picking zircons for the first time soon. I have read a lot of literature related to single-zircon LA-ICPMS work for provenance studies. I am concerned about introducing bias when picking, for example: I seem to be able to spot euhedral zircons better than I do rounded ones. Ideally, I would like to pick the "optimal number" (per sample) for a provenance study (Vermeesch, 2004) but how then do you weight the different types of grains within the sample? A modal abundance of different types of zircon grain within the sample could be used to determine what ratio of round to euhedral (or whatever) would be required, but this seems like it can be difficult to estimate, particularly if you do not have a high purity zircon concentrate. I know this may seem trivial to some, but the more I read, the more concerned I become! Any advice would be much appreciated.
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There is considerable good advice above.  But any hand picking will introduce additional bias in any analysis.  If you want the analysis to be as un-biased as possible, make sure your mineral separates are clean, and this may mean refining the separation process.  Then mount everything, image the mount, and then do a random walk from zircon grain to zircon grain.  
Bear in mind that part of your approach should be directed to what you are tying to accomplish.   You may, for example, select euhedral grains because you are interested in the provenance of first-cycle grains only.  Or perhaps only the rounded grains that may be recycled are of interest.    As you note, the euhedral grains are relatively easy to identify, and but zircons get increasingly more difficult to identify if they are broken, frosted, and they have radiation damage.   As such, it is very easy to bias your data by just focussing on the euhedral grains.
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I need to make a comparison study where I'll need to remove the zircon grains from the mounting after the analysis so I can to some stuff and then mount right back, but the epoxi resin we use is virtually inssoluble and I'm afraid the Entellan might have lead or some other stuff that contaminates my analysis.
Is there any material that I can use that provides easy removal of the grains?
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If you want to keep using the epoxi you could try to remove the zircons grains with a hot needle / soldering iron from the epoxy mount. I did this with quartz grains and it worked very well.
Another option would be to embed the zircon into indium metal. This is a technique developed at the University of California in Los Angeles and used in secondary ion mass spectrometry (Schmitt et al. 2010). You could check, if it also works for LA-ICP-MS. Once the indium mounts are prepared this technique is very quick and easy. You only press the zircon into the soft indium and the mount is ready to use (no waiting time for the mount to harden as with epoxy). The zircon grain can be removed with a small needle. The indium mounts can be reused several times and it’s also possible to polish them. There are no interferences encountered for ion beam overlap with indium.
Schmitt, A.K., Stockli, D.F., Lindsay, J.M., Robertson, R., Lovera, O.M. and Kislitsyn, R., 2010. Episodic growth and homogenization of plutonic roots in arc volcanoes from combined U-Th and (U-Th)/He zircon dating. Earth and Planetary Science Letters, 295(1-2): 91-103. doi: 10.1016/j.epsl.2010.03.028
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Tridacna shell preparation for non-destructive XRF scanning and LA-ICPMS
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Thanks for the advice. Will speak to Peter and will have a go at getting a slice.
They are very big. About 100 Kg!! in weight and 1 m wide.
Henk
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Is there anyone who knows any lab performing in-situ Os-isotope analyses on sulfide minerals?
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Dear Abrahim,
Just to be clear, David Selby and his group  do not carry out in-situ, by which I take it you mean laser ablation MC-ICP-MS or SF-ICP-MS, Os isotope analyses of sulfides.
Myself and Chris Dale on the other hand do carry out in-situ Os isotope analyses by laser ablation MC-ICP-MS but on platinum group metal alloy grains rather than sulfides. We are the only people at Durham carrying out such in-situ Os isotope analyses.
The problem with the in-situ Os isotope analysis of sulfdes is that generally the sulphides are so small and the Os concentrations too low to yield an Os beam size that provides meaningful/accurate Os isotope data. In some cases the Os signal is so low that to perform a mass bias correction during the measurement it also proves necessary to aspirate an Ir solution and mix that with the laser ablation product. Performing accurate Re corrections on the 187Os is also very difficult at low Os beam intensities. There is also the issue that if you've polished a section to expose a sulfide then you will have lost some of that sulfide and if there has been any exsolution it may have fractionated the Re/Os ratio such that the Re/Os ratio you measure on the remaining sulfide may have no bearing on the measured Os isotope composition. In other words the Os isotope compositions is unsupported by the measured Re/Os ratio. A couple of references to look at that discuss some of the issues with in-situ Os measurements are :
Pearson N.J., Alard O., Griffin W.L., Jackson S.E., O'Reilly S.Y., 2002. In situ measurement of Re-Os isotopes in mantle sulfides by laser ablation multicollector–inductively coupled plasma mass spectrometry: Analytical methods and preliminary results. Geochim. Cosmochim. Acta., 66, Number 1037-1050(14).
G.M. Nowell, A. Luguet, D.G. Pearson & M.A. Horstwood (2008a). Precise and accurate 186Os/188Os and 187Os/188Os measurements by Multi- Collector Plasma Ionisation Mass Spectrometry (MC-ICP-MS) part I: solution analyses. Chemical Geology 248: 363-393.
Norm Pearson and Bill Griffin at GEMOC are probably the main group carrying out this kind of analysis so I would contact them if this is really the way you want to go.
Hope this helps. All the best
Geoff
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I am currently trying to measure chromium between 10-20 nmol/L in whole blood by ICP-MS (octopole) but am having problems with sensitivity at the lower end (>20 nmol/L no problems). Can anyone offer any advice or recommend any papers which may help?
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Maybe you could get some hints from this paper:
Wendy Cieslak, Kathleen Pap, Dustin R. Bunch, Edmunds Reineks, Raymond Jackson, Roxanne Steinle, Sihe Wang, Highly sensitive measurement of whole blood chromium by inductively coupled plasma mass spectrometry, Clinical Biochemistry 46 (2013) 266–270. http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.clinbiochem.2012.10.035
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Has anyone else conducting U-Pb LA ICP-MS on calcite, zircon or other minerals encountered variable 238U/206Pb ratios with relatively invariant 207Pb/206Pb ratios?
I've analysed a number of other speleothems from other caves in the UK, Canada and Australia, and the data produce proper isochrons, but all of the samples from Borneo have produced data like this and I have no idea what's causing it. The machine setup was operating within normal parameters and all standard analyses (91500, NIST614 and an "in-house" carbonate standard) behave as normal.
If anyone can suggest any possible causes, or recommend any papers that have dealt with or encountered this, that would be a great help.
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Dear Christopher,
I am slightly puzzled by the fact that this particular stalagmite was shown to be in secular equilibrium (>500 ka) by U-230Th method. A simple calculation shows that if you start accumulating radiogenic lead in a speleothem initially having common Pb (206/204~18.5, 207/204~15.6, and 208_204~38.5) and 238U/206Pb=50, then in 3 Ma in a closed system its 207Pb/206Pb will be =0.68, which is a bit lower than your lowest measured 207Pb/206Pb value. Because 238U/206Pb value decreases with time, measured values of ~1000 in your sample may indicate that initial 238U/206Pb was even higher. For the initial 238U/206Pb=1000 207Pb/206Pb will be =0.15 in 3 Ma, which you do not see. Therefore, there are at least 2 natural reasons to explain your data:
(1) Your speleothem is younger than ~ 50 ka
(2) You deal with open U-Pb system. The first scenario would require COMPLETE loss of radiogenic Pb, which is highly improbable. The second scenario would require very recent considerable U gain, which would result in young 230Th/U ages.
Therefore, my suggestion would be (1) to double check U/Th dating results and confirm that the same materials were analyzed for U-Pb and (2) carefully check the accuracy of your U/Pb ration LAICPMS measurements during the analytical sessions when these data were collected.
I hope this would help in resolving your puzzle.
Best,
Leonid
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I've obtained data by LA-ICP-MS, and now I'm looking for data to compare my results, and whole process of analyse.
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Hi Yuri,
we have a paper accepted with moderate revision in American Mineralogist dealing with Kd on plagioclase, alkali feldspar, Ti-magnetite, biotite and apatite in felsic alkaline volcanic rocks (potassic trachytes and trachyphonolites) from Phlegrean Fields. As soon as we have the paper definitively accepted I can send you the data.
Oter literature data can be found in Villemant (1988; CMP, 98, 169-183) and Pappalardo et al. (2008; CMP, 156, 1-26).
In Fedele et al (2009; CMP, 158, 337-356) you can find Kd of cpx in equilibrium with the same liquids (potassic trachytes and trachyphonolites) from Phlegrean Fields.
Cheers
michele
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I'm trying to understand the post-translational modifications of a certain protein at different conditions. The protein can be immunoprecipitated from mouse tissues.
Is there a proteomic (or other type) techniques available out there that can be used to identify and/or measure the level of ALL, or common post-translational modifications (e.g acetylation, ubiquitination, oxidation, phosphorylation, glycation, etc) of a protein under different treatment conditions in a high throughput manner?
I've asked and I was told that neither 2D gels nor mass spectroscopy can be used for this purpose.
I'll really appreciate any suggestions or ideas.
Thank you.
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Samuel, no single method will provide you with all answer on all possible modifications, and certainly not in "high throughput" (which leaves me puzzled - why are you looking for high throughput if you "only" want to characterize one protein?). You will probably need a combination of separations (2D, SDS-PAGE) combined with MS, Western (provided antibodies can be raised) and other techniques here - in other words, a good old full-blown biochemistry project. It will not be quick or high throughput.
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LA-ICP-MS U-Pb Zircon Dating
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low Th/U (<0.1) in zircon can be an indication of metamorphic origin, however metamorphic zircons with high Th/U exists, particularly in high grade rocks. Ultimately the Th/U in zircon is controlled by other coexisting phases and the presence of Th-rich phases such as allanite or monazite generally infers low Th/U in metamorphic zircon. Rocks in which these phases are not presented or dissolved in anatectic melts will have metamorphic zircon with higher Th/U.
Alone Th/U is not sufficient to define a metamorphic zircon, zoning pattern, inclusions, trace elements and of course age in geological context have to come along as well.